Share Pics of People Hauling or Towing Something Wrong

[Dftodd]

Been watching some of this here.
Many different view points coming from different groups for different reasons.
Myself 110 years seems excessive dependant on some things that we can’t answer from the information we have.
For me to formulate an honest opinion I would need a lot more information and some of the questions that need asked might actually offend some people.
I train many people that English is a second or third language and there are a lot of people who rather than work at understanding, they pretend to understand for whatever reason you can imagine. Some trainers don’t bother to insure they are understood. Some trainers will forgo the need for translators or verification with a translator at the very least.
Could he actually read the road signs?
How much and what quality training did he receive?
Did the training include actual hands on exercise, including hard braking, downshifting, steep hills, hunting gears and exorcises in quick thinking and pushing the drivers nerves to see if they are able to think under pressure?

I have been handed newer drivers that were given very poor training at some very well known trucking companies. No words can describe my I’ll feelings about this training. They are not even trained properly to pass a basic skills test and I wouldn’t have considered them worthy of giving the actual skill test for thier license but here they are standing in front of me saying I have a CDL!

The last one that I worked with came to us with about 300 hours experiance and a valid CDL. During his first on road observation he was flabbergasted when I had him go down the mountain roads where he had to determine proper gearing, when to downshift and had a difficult time holding everything together. He had no true understanding of how to correct mistakes with shifting and needed to come to a complete stop almost every time he missed a shift. Yes he read about hunting gears in a book but never had to put it to practice as his first trainer couldn’t do it himself. This to me should have been clear and practiced long before he was given a basic skills test and issued a CDL.
He could barely back the truck/ trailer and was only able to perform one basic backing maneuver but understood nothing of the reasoning and theory. In simple terms he had nothing to really base things on and build from.
For the drivers out there who wonder why so many are having difficulty at the truck stops and why we instantly move our trucks when certain known carrier trucks even show a hint of issue when backing beside or near us will understand now why unless the conditions are perfect, the stars and planets aligned perfectly these new drivers will tear your mirrors off, at best and destroy your front end at worst unless you move, get out and spot them in or some act of God helps the poor soul to somehow recognize the difference between thier training and this real world situation.Simply put they were not ready to drive solo. They were however shown a few cones told practice this and you’ll get a license when you can do it correctly 2 out of ten times and one of those 2 times happens when the tester is here.

So yes it might be excessive, but it might not be and the people responsible for this could very well include the company, trainers and it certainly does include the politicians who think that the big companies who are being trusted with this driver training can be trusted to complete the task without letting profits get in the way of proper and complete training.

Myself. At night I can sleep well knowing that If my name appears at the bottom of a new drivers certification, that driver will have the tools, knowledge and be confident in handling that truck on thier own.
Otherwise they wont be getting my signature on that form! I highly doubt this guys trainer can say the same unless he is plain and simply put stone stupid or has no ethics at all.

I can back up your sentiment and statements. I work on the tank, box, and pump rental industry.

We are constantly getting 3rd party haulers in to transfer equipment between branches.

We also get a lot of turn around truck traffic through our yard due to how the addresses are listed for the industrial complex we are in. It's the same number, but uses A, B, C D, ect..... for the different lots behind us.

Our yard is set up so semi trucks can move in and out of the property safely and extremely easily.

I've still had drivers that came into the yard and couldn't figure out how to navigate to get back out ( Drive to the end of the racks, swing wide to the left, then drive back out. I looked around trying to figure out what his issue was, and then informed the driver that I'm not a truck driver. But I'm pretty sure that I could navigate around the yard with his 53ft trailer and truck without coming any where close to hitting anything.

We have an 8' wide x 200' in length worth of pipe and hose racks down the center of the yard. The yard is 5 acres worth of space with this rack smack dab in the middle. 300ft of space on 3 sides of the rack and 100ft of distance on the narrow side.

Equipment storage around 2 sides of the rack. Building on the 3rd side, and 100ft between the end of the rack and fence on the fourth side.

 

[4570Man]

Been watching some of this here.
Many different view points coming from different groups for different reasons.
Myself 110 years seems excessive dependant on some things that we can’t answer from the information we have.
For me to formulate an honest opinion I would need a lot more information and some of the questions that need asked might actually offend some people.
I train many people that English is a second or third language and there are a lot of people who rather than work at understanding, they pretend to understand for whatever reason you can imagine. Some trainers don’t bother to insure they are understood. Some trainers will forgo the need for translators or verification with a translator at the very least.
Could he actually read the road signs?
How much and what quality training did he receive?
Did the training include actual hands on exercise, including hard braking, downshifting, steep hills, hunting gears and exorcises in quick thinking and pushing the drivers nerves to see if they are able to think under pressure?

I have been handed newer drivers that were given very poor training at some very well known trucking companies. No words can describe my I’ll feelings about this training. They are not even trained properly to pass a basic skills test and I wouldn’t have considered them worthy of giving the actual skill test for thier license but here they are standing in front of me saying I have a CDL!

The last one that I worked with came to us with about 300 hours experiance and a valid CDL. During his first on road observation he was flabbergasted when I had him go down the mountain roads where he had to determine proper gearing, when to downshift and had a difficult time holding everything together. He had no true understanding of how to correct mistakes with shifting and needed to come to a complete stop almost every time he missed a shift. Yes he read about hunting gears in a book but never had to put it to practice as his first trainer couldn’t do it himself. This to me should have been clear and practiced long before he was given a basic skills test and issued a CDL.
He could barely back the truck/ trailer and was only able to perform one basic backing maneuver but understood nothing of the reasoning and theory. In simple terms he had nothing to really base things on and build from.
For the drivers out there who wonder why so many are having difficulty at the truck stops and why we instantly move our trucks when certain known carrier trucks even show a hint of issue when backing beside or near us will understand now why unless the conditions are perfect, the stars and planets aligned perfectly these new drivers will tear your mirrors off, at best and destroy your front end at worst unless you move, get out and spot them in or some act of God helps the poor soul to somehow recognize the difference between thier training and this real world situation.Simply put they were not ready to drive solo. They were however shown a few cones told practice this and you’ll get a license when you can do it correctly 2 out of ten times and one of those 2 times happens when the tester is here.

So yes it might be excessive, but it might not be and the people responsible for this could very well include the company, trainers and it certainly does include the politicians who think that the big companies who are being trusted with this driver training can be trusted to complete the task without letting profits get in the way of proper and complete training.

Myself. At night I can sleep well knowing that If my name appears at the bottom of a new drivers certification, that driver will have the tools, knowledge and be confident in handling that truck on thier own.
Otherwise they wont be getting my signature on that form! I highly doubt this guys trainer can say the same unless he is plain and simply put stone stupid or has no ethics at all.

I’m sure lack of training was the leading contributor in the crash. But ultimately he was the one that decided to drive the truck down the mountain. Where does accountability for your own actions come into play? And maybe he couldn’t read the signs. But again that’s nobody’s fault but his own.

 

[JDZ735M]

A bit off topic, but what are people using? I hear that Milwaukee makes a real nut breaker, but I went with a Dewalt as I have several batteries. So far I haven't gotten a chance to try it out but plan to use it soon, putting my sawmill together.

I got the Milwaukee because it had the highest torque rating of all I could find. Model 2767. 1400 ft-lbs. 1/2" drive.

Good on mower blades too.

 

[paulfun9]

I can back up your sentiment and statements. I work on the tank, box, and pump rental industry.

We are constantly getting 3rd party haulers in to transfer equipment between branches.

We also get a lot of turn around truck traffic through our yard due to how the addresses are listed for the industrial complex we are in. It's the same number, but uses A, B, C D, ect..... for the different lots behind us.

Our yard is set up so semi trucks can move in and out of the property safely and extremely easily.

I've still had drivers that came into the yard and couldn't figure out how to navigate to get back out ( Drive to the end of the racks, swing wide to the left, then drive back out. I looked around trying to figure out what his issue was, and then informed the driver that I'm not a truck driver. But I'm pretty sure that I could navigate around the yard with his 53ft trailer and truck without coming any where close to hitting anything.

We have an 8' wide x 200' in length worth of pipe and hose racks down the center of the yard. The yard is 5 acres worth of space with this rack smack dab in the middle. 300ft of space on 3 sides of the rack and 100ft of distance on the narrow side.

Equipment storage around 2 sides of the rack. Building on the 3rd side, and 100ft between the end of the rack and fence on the fourth

I’m sure lack of training was the leading contributor in the crash. But ultimately he was the one that decided to drive the truck down the mountain. Where does accountability for your own actions come into play? And maybe he couldn’t read the signs. But again that’s nobody’s fault but his own.

I am not arguing the personal accountability but. I find the rest to be very important as well and if training and corporate greed played a part feel that they should be considered guilty as well. Not to mention the accountability of the politicians who let thier wallets and big donations cloud thier ethics and decision making!

 

[LD48750]

I’m sure lack of training was the leading contributor in the crash. But ultimately he was the one that decided to drive the truck down the mountain. Where does accountability for your own actions come into play? And maybe he couldn’t read the signs. But again that’s nobody’s fault but his own.

Are you trying to suggest personal accountability?
That is ridiculous.
Everyone KNOWS everything is someone elses fault, probably President Trumps.

 

[duramaxsky]

We don't know if he still had brakes when he passed the runaway ramp. If he did I don't feel sorry for him. If not that changes everything. It's expensive to use one of those ramps. If he didn't use it for fear of loosing his job I don't feel sorry for him. If he started down the hill too fast I don't feel sorry for him. Brakes get hot and fade. You can prevent that by slowing down before you crest the hill. If you are at the correct speed the engine brake will maintain speed with almost no use of the service brakes. If you don't use the service brakes one emergency stop is available even on a steep downhill. And yes poor training is a possible factor. But the company who hired him should have taken care of that. I am a trainer at my company. And we hire drivers right out of school. They work with me or the other trainer until we are confident they are ready. There is no pressure from management to get it done quickly. They don't go out on their own until one of us says they are ready. And if we don't get to that point they let them go. We have a shortage of drivers but they don't want any unsafe drivers in our trucks. They will pay them for several weeks of training if we say they are not ready. After paying them all that time they will cut them loose if we say they just don't meet our high standards. Their safety and that of the others on the road is just too important. One guy I just couldn't get to where I thought he was ok crashed and killed himself about a year later at another employer. Honestly that has made me even more careful about who I say is ready.

 

[Yogi05]

I am not arguing the personal accountability but. I find the rest to be very important as well and if training and corporate greed played a part feel that they should be considered guilty as well. Not to mention the accountability of the politicians who let thier wallets and big donations cloud thier ethics and decision making!

I agree completely, and there is always things like people tossing something in the truck bed and saying "it can't go anywhere" or "it'll be fine".
By that I mean low information individuals who can't tell you what ten feet looks like, or estimate whether it's 25 lbs or 100 lbs.
There's people (even professional loaders at warehouses) convinced everything heavy goes in the front of the trailer. Low information. And that puts people in
dangerous situations sometimes.
Actually, this is the exact reason for this thread. All the pics of crazy loads. I call that low information.
Fun fact; the gov guide to load weights in Ontario is something like 90 pages. Most is vehicle specs, but quite a few pages on how and where to put cargo in your trailer etc.

 

[4570Man]

We don't know if he still had brakes when he passed the runaway ramp. If he did I don't feel sorry for him. If not that changes everything. It's expensive to use one of those ramps. If he didn't use it for fear of loosing his job I don't feel sorry for him. If he started down the hill too fast I don't feel sorry for him. Brakes get hot and fade. You can prevent that by slowing down before you crest the hill. If you are at the correct speed the engine brake will maintain speed with almost no use of the service brakes. If you don't use the service brakes one emergency stop is available even on a steep downhill. And yes poor training is a possible factor. But the company who hired him should have taken care of that. I am a trainer at my company. And we hire drivers right out of school. They work with me or the other trainer until we are confident they are ready. There is no pressure from management to get it done quickly. They don't go out on their own until one of us says they are ready. And if we don't get to that point they let them go. We have a shortage of drivers but they don't want any unsafe drivers in our trucks. They will pay them for several weeks of training if we say they are not ready. After paying them all that time they will cut them loose if we say they just don't meet our high standards. Their safety and that of the others on the road is just too important. One guy I just couldn't get to where I thought he was ok crashed and killed himself about a year later at another employer. Honestly that has made me even more careful about who I say is ready.

There’s a video of him blowing the runaway ramp at like 80 so it’s pretty apparent he wasn’t in control at that point. Apparently he passed more than 1 ramp too. He was also rolling in neutral apparently. It was apparently a 6 percent hill. That’s a pretty good hill but it was a 45 mph zone. The engine brake will hold 6 percent at 45 all day long and never touch the service brakes. Apparently the trailer also didn’t have functional brakes before he even started. I’m guessing he hit to top of the hill too fast to behind with, never downshifted, didn’t have working trailer brakes, not that they would’ve helped a lot and smoked the tractor brakes.

 

[paulfun9]

We don't know if he still had brakes when he passed the runaway ramp. If he did I don't feel sorry for him. If not that changes everything. It's expensive to use one of those ramps. If he didn't use it for fear of loosing his job I don't feel sorry for him. If he started down the hill too fast I don't feel sorry for him. Brakes get hot and fade. You can prevent that by slowing down before you crest the hill. If you are at the correct speed the engine brake will maintain speed with almost no use of the service brakes. If you don't use the service brakes one emergency stop is available even on a steep downhill. And yes poor training is a possible factor. But the company who hired him should have taken care of that. I am a trainer at my company. And we hire drivers right out of school. They work with me or the other trainer until we are confident they are ready. There is no pressure from management to get it done quickly. They don't go out on their own until one of us says they are ready. And if we don't get to that point they let them go. We have a shortage of drivers but they don't want any unsafe drivers in our trucks. They will pay them for several weeks of training if we say they are not ready. After paying them all that time they will cut them loose if we say they just don't meet our high standards. Their safety and that of the others on the road is just too important. One guy I just couldn't get to where I thought he was ok crashed and killed himself about a year later at another employer. Honestly that has made me even more careful about who I say is ready.

Like I stated before, there is so many things we need to know before we can make an informed decision on everything.
Glad to hear from someone else who doesn’t deal with the bull when training and sorry to hear that someone you decided DID NOT QUALIFY was able to have someplace else put him on the road. I wonder how the person who signed him off feels about it?

 

[Redlands Okie]

A bit off topic, but what are people using? I hear that Milwaukee makes a real nut breaker, but I went with a Dewalt as I have several batteries. So far I haven't gotten a chance to try it out but plan to use it soon, putting my sawmill together.

Keep in mind that both brands sell impacts in a variety of different drive sizes. The important part is that they all have models with a variety of torque in the same drive size.