Timbren rear suspension system ??

[roadhunter]

I have used air bags on my ram 2500 for years. Works great and is simple to use.

 

[jimmysisson]

Coobie, I think you'll like the Timbrens. As you note, unladen ride is same as stock. You just have more faith that when you find a nice big welder at a garage sale you don't blind oncoming traffic getting it home. I like mine, but rarely load my 2008 Chev half ton very heavy.
Jim

 

[rankrank1]

I have heard (and seen internet pics) of the 1500 Ram rear coil spring designed trucks suffering from excessive sag when loaded even moderately, but I thought the 2500 Rams coils were supposed to handle a load much better in comparison. Spec wise the Ram 2500 payload #'s always seem impressive (on paper anyways) where the Ram 1500's payload #'s are often puny depending on configuration.

What kinda trailer weights and tongue weights did you feel the Timbrens were necessary for on the 2500? (A Ram 2500 6.4 is on my wish list... if I can only convince myself to part with that much $....all trucks are overpriced IMOP)?

 

[coobie]

I have heard (and seen internet pics) of the 1500 Ram rear coil spring designed trucks suffering from excessive sag when loaded even moderately, but I thought the 2500 Rams coils were supposed to handle a load much better in comparison. Spec wise the Ram 2500 payload #'s always seem impressive (on paper anyways) where the Ram 1500's payload #'s are often puny depending on configuration.

What kinda trailer weights and tongue weights did you feel the Timbrens were necessary for on the 2500? (A Ram 2500 6.4 is on my wish list... if I can only convince myself to part with that much $....all trucks are overpriced IMOP)?

Towing about 11,000-12,000 lbs couple times per year.Wanted to correct the slight sag I had with that weight the reason for the Timbren install.The 6.4 hemi pulls that weight very well.

 

[Copperhead]

Regarding the air bag thing.... ever wonder why the majority of heavy commercial trucks have gone to air ride suspensions since the 80's? They just plain work great! Springs are so old school, and Timbrens just make it even worse. Air is the only way to do it right and supplement stock springs. The only real decision is whether one needs an on board air compressor or not.

 

[coobie]

Regarding the air bag thing.... ever wonder why the majority of heavy commercial trucks have gone to air ride suspensions since the 80's? They just plain work great! Springs are so old school, and Timbrens just make it even worse. Air is the only way to do it right and supplement stock springs. The only real decision is whether one needs an on board air compressor or not.

To each his own I guess.You know that they say about opinions.

 

[TMGT]

There are still a lot of trucks being made that use all rubber suspension, see it a lot on the trash trucks I get to work on.
Good durable suspension, not the softest ride but not horrible, an seems to hold up well, plus they are compact.

My rollback had a similar system to the Timbren, it was designed to be low profile so it pretty much rode just off the rubber unloaded, not comfortable at all on rough roads, might have been part of the reason I went air bags.
Other reason was to be able to adjust for the load by air pressure since I have regular changes in needs between different trailers and what I put in the back of the truck.

Sounds like Timbren will work good for your application which ultimately is all that matters!
If we all had the same needs and requirements the world would be a boring place.

 

[FredH]

Although I have never even seen the brand / style You used , I don't see why they won't work . For Years I ran leaf style overload springs on my old '84 Ford F250 4x4 hauling wood , gravel , etc.... The trick to installing any spring type overload , is NOT to jack up the truck during install . Like what You stated on installing Yours about the gap after install . with leaf style springs , One wants those to be in a neutral state during unladen times . Seen many people jack up their trucks , install overload leafs , set truck back down and then wonder why it rides so rough . That Ford was a every day driver , 5 or 6 daysa week commuter for over 10 years . Then on Weekends it was the work truck .
Now on My '06 ram 2500 quad cab 4 wheel drive , I installed the airlift system without a compressor . Each side has it's own inflation valve . Unladen , air is kept right at 18 - 20 psi . Is ride any rougher with bags versus no bags unladen ? Only time I even notice the ride is going over a speed bump at Lowes or someweres else .
Ride is also effected by tire brand , style and air pressure . That was the case with My wifes Subaru forester awhile back . Car always seem to be " rough " or even seemed to be bottoming out with Factory Michelins , ( I Think they were Michelins , Don't quote me on that . Do know We have a different brand now ) . Now She has Firestone's or ??? , ( at 3:30 in the morning and 28 degree's outside , I am not going to go look ) , But just the different brand of tire with same air pressure and Her Forester now rides really nice .


Fred H.

 

[JJZ 109]

I've had Timbrens on a couple of F150s and now have them on my 2016 F250. Kinda like Coobie, I don't tow or load heavy all that often. They're nice to have on the occasions I pull a 5th wheel camper (probably 10k or so). Any other time, the Timbrens aren't touching the stops and the truck rides stock. I've also had air bags on a 150. A nice option to be sure, but a little costly if you don't use them often.

 

[ihcfan]

I have had Timbrens on the rear of my 2001 F-350 for 10 years. They work perfect for me. I set them with the 1" gap per directions. Ride good under all conditions.

 

[Copperhead]

I might have missed it, but I don't recall anyone mentioning Sumo Springs. The best of both worlds. Something that replaces the bump stops, is a plug and play and forget thing like Timbrens, but have a similar ride and effect as air bags. I recently ordered up a set to Sumo's for my 2500. Check them out and see if they might be a viable option.

SumoSprings - YouTube

 

[coobie]

Actually I like my Timbrens I installed,they ride nice unloaded and serve my purpose when hauling my trailer.To each his own.

 

[rdinatal]

It was an easy choice for me. Sumo with a 1 year warranty or Timbren with a lifetime warranty...

-R

 

[Copperhead]

As I stated in the other post you made regarding the warranty, warranty does not imply a inferior product. Unless you can show a pattern of failures in the Sumo Spring product your comment is just short of worthless. My commercial trucks all have 1 yr / 100,000 mile warranties from the manufacturer, but I typically take them over 1 million miles and only repairs are normal wear and tear stuff that isn't covered by the warranty to begin with. There are many products that have exceptional warranties that I would not consider using simply because they don't do the job I want done.

Perspective is everything. Paul Gibson was at both Air Lift and Firestone for over 40 years as a project manager. He had tried to get both Air Lift and Firestone to do some R&D on something like the closed cell polyurethane foam concept for years, to no avail. When he found out SuperSprings was doing the SumoSpring thing and using closed cell polyurethane to get the same effect as an air bag without the issues he jumped ship and became project manager for them. This is one of the primary reasons I chose the SumoSpring option recently. Not like this is some sort of goofy idea that someone cooked up in a garage somewhere. it has been used in Europe and Africa specifically for many years. That, and unlike the Timbrens, the Sumo's reside directly on the axle all the time just like air bags, loaded or unloaded. There is no gap that could cause a suspension jolt. You get immediate effect just like an air bag and it is progressive in resistance just like an air bag as it is collapsed.

And bore a 1.5" hole thru a Timbren or an air bag and see if they still work as well as a Sumo that has had that done to it. That was one of the tests they used to make sure that the product works under extreme conditions.

Warranties are marketing gimmicks in many cases. No manufacturer is even required to offer a warranty all all per the Federal Trade Commission.

 

[coobie]

As I stated in the other post you made regarding the warranty, warranty does not imply a inferior product. Unless you can show a pattern of failures in the Sumo Spring product your comment is just short of worthless. My commercial trucks all have 1 yr / 100,000 mile warranties from the manufacturer, but I typically take them over 1 million miles and only repairs are normal wear and tear stuff that isn't covered by the warranty to begin with. There are many products that have exceptional warranties that I would not consider using simply because they don't do the job I want done.

Perspective is everything. Paul Gibson was at both Air Lift and Firestone for over 40 years as a project manager. He had tried to get both Air Lift and Firestone to do some R&D on something like the closed cell polyurethane foam concept for years, to no avail. When he found out SuperSprings was doing the SumoSpring thing and using closed cell polyurethane to get the same effect as an air bag without the issues he jumped ship and became project manager for them. This is one of the primary reasons I chose the SumoSpring option recently. Not like this is some sort of goofy idea that someone cooked up in a garage somewhere. it has been used in Europe and Africa specifically for many years. That, and unlike the Timbrens, the Sumo's reside directly on the axle all the time just like air bags, loaded or unloaded. There is no gap that could cause a suspension jolt. You get immediate effect just like an air bag and it is progressive in resistance just like an air bag as it is collapsed.

And bore a 1.5" hole thru a Timbren or an air bag and see if they still work as well as a Sumo that has had that done to it. That was one of the tests they used to make sure that the product works under extreme conditions.

Warranties are marketing gimmicks in many cases. No manufacturer is even required to offer a warranty all all per the Federal Trade Commission.

Sorry you feel other opinions are worthless except YOURS..You know what that say about opinions they are like A-holes.Everyone has one.

 

[Copperhead]

No, don't try to play that liberal, cry baby stuff and inject words into what I stated. I never dissed any other alternative product and said that it was crap, I was purely holding up the one I was talking about. There is a place for all options. It all depends on the needs and the cost benefit ratio involved. What I was purely stating was the fact of the Sumo's and Paul Gibson who was deeply involved in Air Lift and Firestone air bag systems deciding that the technology that SuperSprings is using is a viable solution and fits a great middle ground between timbren and full air bags with the benefits of each while avoiding some of the negatives of each. And Warranties are indeed marketing tools to convince consumers to buy products. There is little correlation between a warranty length of time and a product reliability.

 

[coobie]

No, don't try to play that liberal, cry baby stuff and inject words into what I stated. I never dissed any other alternative product and said that it was crap, I was purely holding up the one I was talking about. There is a place for all options. It all depends on the needs and the cost benefit ratio involved. What I was purely stating was the fact of the Sumo's and Paul Gibson who was deeply involved in Air Lift and Firestone air bag systems deciding that the technology that SuperSprings is using is a viable solution and fits a great middle ground between timbren and full air bags with the benefits of each while avoiding some of the negatives of each. And Warranties are indeed marketing tools to convince consumers to buy products. There is little correlation between a warranty length of time and a product reliability.

Laffin,take it easy my friend you are the one who stated(posts #31 & 34) "just short of worthless"plus "forget get things like Timbrens" funny that statement not is dissing other products?Oh,don't forget your post#25 in this thread how timbrens "only make it worse" Some extended research on your part on the sumo & timbrens on the RVnet.com website might be benficial.Both are well liked by the towing community.As far a liberal comment leave that political crap on the sidelines it serves NO purpose.(PS)I tow in US not Europe or Africa I could care less about those 2 countries.H,mm that must be the Trump side of me coming out,laffin.

 

[Copperhead]

Yes, I did say the opinion was short of worthless, mainly because it was off the cuff and not backed up with any empirical data to support it. There was no evidence or pointing to such to show that failure rates for Sumo's were an issue that the warranty was not sufficient for the product.

And, the warranty being espoused in those posts as a negative for the Sumo's was in error. It is not 1 year, but 3 years. Look on their site.

You have the "forget things like timbrens" out of context. You are in error. Go back and look what I said..... "is a plug and play and forget thing like Timbrens" My comment was simply stating the Sumo's are comparable to Timbrens in that they can be installed and require no further maintenance. You know... Plug, Play, and Forget. That is actually a supportive comment as opposed to a negative one regarding a feature of Timbrens.

Regarding the Timbrens only make it worse comment... sure I said it and stand by it. But again, context is everything. I was stating that regular springs are so old school, and they are, compared to air suspension systems when it comes to hauling and towing. And Timbrens are no help in that regard. They just mask a problem. Unfortunately, anything we put on a spring suspension is going to mask the problem. The OEM's should be offering total air ride suspension options for their pickups as the heavy OEM's do for commercial trucks. Then we wouldn't be wasting time discussing any of this.

So your post is without merit. I still have not dissed any other product and you cannot prove from any post that I have. I have only made supportive comments about the Sumo product. At least try to be honest in what you are attempting to do. You are not doing yourself or your arguments any favors.

I always take it easy, or any way I can take it. And the liberal comment, yeah, you are doing what many in the media do.... pick and choose what is said, reorganize it to fit what you want it to say, and then try to beat someone over the head with it and put them on the defensive. It is sad our society has sunk to this level across the spectrum and is really picking up on this tactic in forums that are not even political in nature.

 

[rdinatal]

I went with Timbren because of the warranty.

-R

 

[coobie]

Yes, I did say the opinion was short of worthless, mainly because it was off the cuff and not backed up with any empirical data to support it. There was no evidence or pointing to such to show that failure rates for Sumo's were an issue that the warranty was not sufficient for the product.

And, the warranty being espoused in those posts as a negative for the Sumo's was in error. It is not 1 year, but 3 years. Look on their site.

You have the "forget things like timbrens" out of context. You are in error. Go back and look what I said..... "is a plug and play and forget thing like Timbrens" My comment was simply stating the Sumo's are comparable to Timbrens in that they can be installed and require no further maintenance. You know... Plug, Play, and Forget. That is actually a supportive comment as opposed to a negative one regarding a feature of Timbrens.

Regarding the Timbrens only make it worse comment... sure I said it and stand by it. But again, context is everything. I was stating that regular springs are so old school, and they are, compared to air suspension systems when it comes to hauling and towing. And Timbrens are no help in that regard. They just mask a problem. Unfortunately, anything we put on a spring suspension is going to mask the problem. The OEM's should be offering total air ride suspension options for their pickups as the heavy OEM's do for commercial trucks. Then we wouldn't be wasting time discussing any of this.

So your post is without merit. I still have not dissed any other product and you cannot prove from any post that I have. I have only made supportive comments about the Sumo product. At least try to be honest in what you are attempting to do. You are not doing yourself or your arguments any favors.

I always take it easy, or any way I can take it. And the liberal comment, yeah, you are doing what many in the media do.... pick and choose what is said, reorganize it to fit what you want it to say, and then try to beat someone over the head with it and put them on the defensive. It is sad our society has sunk to this level across the spectrum and is really picking up on this tactic in forums that are not even political in nature.

Nice try with the DEFLECTION post.Hey its your story go with it.My dad taught me at a early age never argue to long with idiots they will bring you down and try to beat you with experience.You win,laffin..