One step closer to permanent wood heat ban in California?

[ultrarunner]

Air quality districts are moving ahead with plans to permanently burn wood burning by requiring the removal of code approved/permitted wood burning fireplaces, stoves and inserts at the time of sale or rental.

Plan to require fireplace retrofits at Bay Area homes for sale heats up smoke debate - ContraCostaTimes.com


Over 1.4 million homes in my area would be affected by the local air district decision.

Back in 2007 the "Spare the Air" campaign was rolled out as a simple and effective measure to reduce air pollution and now regulators are saying it is time for more stringent measures such as the banning the sale of homes and commercial property not in compliance...

I have noticed a drastic change just in firewood here... I have an abundance of storm fall oak each year that would have people lining up for and now... it can't be given away... even split seasoned and delivered...

Remember when California started with unleaded fuel and others said it would never happen in their state has me wondering how long before wood heat is banned nationwide?

 

[motownbrowne]

I was in St. Louis recently. We were in an area with lots of antique stores, so we poked our heads into several of them. They were old brick buildings, 2 or 3 stories tall. I was really surprised when we went into several that were burning firewood in old barrel stoves. They were certainly not equipped with any emissions reducing features. I have never seen something like that in any large American city.

Personally, I burn a lot of wood, only half of it through any type of EPA compliant stove. In fact I'm getting close to having burned 1/2 a cord already today in the maple syrup cooker. That said, I think there is a place for emissions regulations, many of our neighbors don't think twice about burning wet or green wood in their outdoor boilers. The result is a slow, smokey fire that smokes up the whole neighborhood. These guys live in fear of emissions regulations like what you just referenced. Maybe if they would burn dry wood, they wouldn't get near as many complaints, and would prolong the ban a little longer.

I do know that if I lived in a city, with lots of neighbors, I'd at least want some enforcement on air quality. Now, removing wood burners as a requirement for sale does seem a bit far-reaching, though. Maybe requiring update at time of sale or something. Would make more sense.

 

[pohorsky]

No too long ago my aunt and uncle who live in Santa Clara decided to remodel their house and wanted to maintain their wood burning fireplace. They could not move their existing fireplace and had to place all the demolition and construction around the pre-existing fire place. I dread the day when we can no longer do any range improvement burns on our property. Already regardless if it is a permissible day to burn or not the town next to us cannot burn during the second half of the month.

I have this strange hunch that the bad air in the Bay Area is not caused by fireplaces burning wood.

 

[3930dave]

Interesting how more States are legalizing weed, at the same time that burning wood is being outlawed. Being able to get stoned takes legal precendence over heating your home.

Ben Franklin has to be spinning in his grave.

The Solution Desperately Seeking a Problem behaviour of the EPA got old some time ago. Note on the present Wikipedia entry for the EPA, they show smoke stacks from the '70s.

Once heavy industry was wiped off the northern part of the continent, they had to invent new targets to justify their existence/budget.

One member here has a sad thread about being hounded by the EPA to pay for cleanup of land his family bought in 1948. US Army/Navy munitions had been dumped on this land circa WWII. EPA comes along, decades later, does a Superfund cleanup, then now is trying to stick the present private landowners with the bill.

Something really smells, and it ain't the air-quality.

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

At the same time, it's also instructive to look at what situations the EPA does ignore.

What is U.S. electricity generation by energy source? - FAQ - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

You can't burn a few cords of wood UR, but 39% of the USA electricity in 2013 came from Coal ?

I colour myself pragmatic green, that is part of why I find this crony-capitalism-in-disguise irritating.

Rgds, D.

 

[KennyG]

For those who haven't been keeping up, the EPA has created new rules requiring major reductions in wood stove particulate emissions. This will raise the cost of wood stoves significantly. Here in Michigan, the state is passing a law preventing the EPA rule from being enforced, because of the potential impact on low income households. I was surprised to find that 10% of the homes in the US get at least some of the heat from wood.

 

[ultrarunner]

Controlled burns will soon be a thing of the past... friends with orchards have already had problems and must justify why the material cannot be chipped or hauled out.

About the only viable reason is blight contaminated/infected trees and trimmings.

Everything I referenced is in California although Western Washington is not much different with no burn days in winter.

 

[EddieWalker]

Once they succeed in this, they will go after something else. Just a matter of time until they ban privately owned vehicles and force everyone to ride public transportation.


Eddie

 

[Jon Heron]

Jesus Christ! :thumbdown:
Its difficult to understand how gun control legislation never gets any traction in the US yet these crazy proposed controls seem to get all kinds of traction...
Whats next!
Cheers,
Jon

 

[Texas Dawg]

Since they have deemed CO2 a pollutant, I'm sure California will soon ban breathing (You may inhale, but you are not allowed to exhale). It is California, so anything and everything, no matter how ridiculous is a possibility.

 

[dave1949]

The EPA has nothing to do with California outlawing or attempting to outlaw all wood burning. I can imagine that other states that want to get rid of the outdoor boiler smokers will also have regs that attempt to do that. Before getting on an EPA rant, people should know the facts of the issue.

Yes, the EPA set a new particulate emission standard for most new wood burning appliances. The old standard dates back to 1988, with amended testing procedures in 1996. It doesn't apply to coal stoves. The EPA is not mandating that "poor" people upgrade or replace their existing wood stoves. A dealer cannot sell non-compliant stoves but they will be available on the used market--from California apparently.

There are many stoves in production now that will meet the new 2015 EPA standards of 4.5 grams per hour. Most of the currently certified stoves listed in the link below that have grams per hour of 2.5 or less already meet the Step 2 requirements that go into effect 5 years from now (2020): http://www2.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2013-08/documents/certifiedwood.pdf

FACT SHEET: Summary of Requirements for Woodstoves and Pellet Stoves | Controlling Air Pollution from Residential Wood Heaters | US EPA

 

[rmk700]

They tried banning burning here in Utah but so many poeple pitched a fit and determined the percentage was so low it was not worth banning.

 

[ultrarunner]

The EPA has nothing to do with California outlawing or attempting to outlaw all wood burning. I can imagine that other states that want to get rid of the outdoor boiler smokers will also have regs that attempt to do that. Before getting on an EPA rant, people should know the facts of the issue.

Yes, the EPA set a new particulate emission standard for most new wood burning appliances. The old standard dates back to 1988, with amended testing procedures in 1996. It doesn't apply to coal stoves. The EPA is not mandating that "poor" people upgrade or replace their existing wood stoves. A dealer cannot sell non-compliant stoves but they will be available on the used market--from California apparently.

There are many stoves in production now that will meet the new 2015 EPA standards of 4.5 grams per hour. Most of the currently certified stoves listed in the link below that have grams per hour of 2.5 or less already meet the Step 2 requirements that go into effect 5 years from now (2020): http://www2.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2013-08/documents/certifiedwood.pdf

FACT SHEET: Summary of Requirements for Woodstoves and Pellet Stoves | Controlling Air Pollution from Residential Wood Heaters | US EPA

The article did mention the impetus for the new regulation is failure to obtain EPA compliance.

Quote:



This new proposal goes much further.

It recommends that after Nov. 1, 2016, Bay Area homes and commercial buildings could not be sold if they contained old fireplaces, stoves or other wood-burning devices that failed to meet federal EPA emission standards.



Having a little knowledge of how things work it is not unusual for whatever group to lobby or convince the legislative body or public to implement enabling legislation and then come back and say new regulation is necessary to achieve EPA compliance... almost like one hand washes the other.

 

[ultrarunner]

Once they succeed in this, they will go after something else. Just a matter of time until they ban privately owned vehicles and force everyone to ride public transportation.


Eddie

Efforts are already underway...

The proposal to float toll lanes on bay area highways and a move to restrict pre 1976 automobiles along with a concerted effort to get old cars off the road to the point of public funds being used to pay $1000 to owners of "Older Technology" vehicles under the States Vehicle Retirement Program.

 

[byronlj]

Efforts are already underway...

The proposal to float toll lanes on bay area highways and a move to restrict pre 1976 automobiles along with a concerted effort to get old cars off the road to the point of public funds being used to pay $1000 to owners of "Older Technology" vehicles under the States Vehicle Retirement Program.

And another epa invasion into our lives that I read last week. The epa wants to limit the amount of time you take showers in a hotel. The article said most hotel systems are equipped to monitor this without too much modification.
Dave

 

[coobie]

Jesus Christ! :thumbdown:
Its difficult to understand how gun control legislation never gets any traction in the US yet these crazy proposed controls seem to get all kinds of traction...
Whats next!
Cheers,
Jon

Once they get your guns,HANG ON.

 

[cat fever]

I want to make sure I understand;
So the clean air people want to ban wood burning in a controlled burn. (fireplace/woodstove) And replace it with the out of control wild fires that will now have much more fuel since we cannot collect wood and burn in our stoves any more. I'm not sure I can see the logic in this, I need more education. One way or another the wood is going to burn. Heating our homes or larger wild fires.

 

[cat fever]

I want to make sure I understand;
So the clean air people want to ban wood burning in a controlled burn. (fireplace/woodstove) And replace it with the out of control wild fires that will now have much more fuel since we cannot collect wood and burn in our stoves any more. I'm not sure I can see the logic in this, I need more education. One way or another the wood is going to burn. Heating our homes or larger wild fires.

Next they will be saying we can't make dust with our tractors!

 

[tcartwri]

In our area it's the home owners insurance companies that have basically banned wood stoves in your home.

 

[jk96]

Once they succeed in this, they will go after something else. Just a matter of time until they ban privately owned vehicles and force everyone to ride public transportation.


Eddie

You may not be far off base Eddy. If they can go after BBQ grills and push to monitor shower times at hotels I don't see anything as out of reach for them.

WFB’s Harrington Breaks Down The EPA’s Focus on Drippings from Backyard Grills | Washington Free Beacon

Next they will be saying we can't make dust with our tractors!

They have already tried and the proposals were shelved a few years back.

EPA announces it will not tighten farm dust regulations | AgriPulse