GM in deep with this Ignition Switch Issue

[Diamondpilot]

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/gm-recall/gm-takes-heat-families-nhtsa-congress-n69166

Another report I read states the fix was $.57 per vehicle but GM deemed it too costly.

Chris

 

[arnoldziffel]

Were these switches installed only on vehicles built by the "old" bankrupt General Motors? Not the new GM?

Is the US government still a major stockholder in the new GM?

 

[murphy1244]

Can't trust ANY of these Car Companies!

 

[Ford850]

"Old" vs "New" is a joke. Companies do that as part of their sweet deal when they go bankrupt. They run a company into the ground, throwing ethics out the window along the way. Then they file for bankruptcy and declare they are a "New" company, leaving all their bills ,dirty laundry, and liability in the past. It's not just GM that has done this, but they are the most recent and biggest offender. How many decision makers at the New GM, were employed by the Old GM? Most of them.

 

[houstonscott]

"Old" vs "New" is a joke. Companies do that as part of their sweet deal when they go bankrupt. They run a company into the ground, throwing ethics out the window along the way. Then they file for bankruptcy and declare they are a "New" company, leaving all their bills ,dirty laundry, and liability in the past. It's not just GM that has done this, but they are the most recent and biggest offender. How many decision makers at the New GM, were employed by the Old GM? Most of them.

Don't put five pounds of **** on your key chain and your good to go.... HS

 

[murphy1244]

Don't put five pounds of **** on your key chain and your good to go.... HS

That been a problem for a long time on all Auto's

 

[Ford850]

From the testimony:

Rep. Diana DeGette, D-Colo., held up a switch for one of the cars and said a small spring inside it failed to provide enough force, causing car engines to turn off when they went over a bump.
DeGette showed how easy it was for a light set of keys to move the ignition out of the "run" position. That can cause the engine to stall and the driver to lose power steering and power brakes.
GM has said that in 2005 company engineers proposed solutions to the switch problem but that the automaker concluded that none represented "an acceptable business case."
"Documents provided by GM show that this unacceptable cost increase was only 57 cents," DeGette said.
Rep. Tim Murphy, R-Pa., chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations, read from an e-mail exchange between GM employees and those at Delphi, which made the switch. One said that the Cobalt is "blowing up in their face in regards to the car turning off."

 

[houstonscott]

What does it matter now? Sound familiar. HS

 

[joemd11]

GM's actions in this situation are reprehensible! People died and their families suffer due to the decisions of a few callous and short-sighted people. Unfortunately these people will never be punished for their actions. I doubt the company can survive this and a lot of people, who had nothing to do with making these bad decisions, are going to lose their jobs.

 

[NS Gearhead]

I've got a 2005 Cobalt. Got the recall letter. They don't have the parts yet... so... LOL

 

[square1]

Interesting bit on the news last night stating the "Replacement Switch: and "Original Equipment Switch" have the same part number stamped on them. Why? Cover-up? In any event, now mechanics can't tell if a switch has been changed or not.

 

[Bigkrank]

I've always been amazed this doesn't happen more often. All the Big Three automakers will drop you as a supplier for a few tenths of a cent in price on certain parts. Toyota and Honda are a bit more loyal but still price is a big driver in who gets/keeps the business. Some parts we make over 40,000,000 of a year so a half a cent a piece can add up.

How parts are spec'd can be an issue also. I remember a sister company had to make a Cadillac ashtray that was spec'd to function to 40 degrees below zero. They got it but it was hard to open at normal temps but still within force specified. Finally someone with some brains changed the temperature spec.

 

[Bigkrank]

I remember about 20 years ago when some Einstein at Ford had a new wheel nut & wheel design and we made the parts to their spec. Long story short, wheels started flying off Broncos and some Ford big shot's wife happened to be driving one and got left sit along side the road in Michigan. I always wondered how long that would have went on if that hadn't happened to her. We were told hush hush but I assume the statute of limitations is over for that.

I don't feel bad for spilling my guts now, was called into ***** session at Ford and found all our parts well within design specs. Any idiot could have told them, as we did, that this was a bad design. Believe it or not, I have a Ford Escort story that tops that but another day.

 

[CalG]

Of course, there is no assurance that "the fix" would not just cause troubles elsewhere.

VW-Audi had a switch problem as well. The electrical portion (not the lock portion) would wear through at the spring detent. Then the entire mechanism would jamb.
The failure would usually occur when starting up. Then the starter motor wouldn't de-energize. That $15 switch would cost an unattetive driver a new starter motor in about 3 minutes.

I replaced two (two different cars) and kept a replacement in the glovebox of the '1996 A6. There is probably still one out in the shop on a shelf somewhere.
'Never even thought that it was a "defect" or worthy of recall. Stuff wears out. The part worked fine when it was new! It was general knowledge with the Audi crowd "Don't hang crap from the key chain"! That was enough. (A word, To the wise, Is sufficient!"

PIA job to replace too....

 

[k0ua]

You know you hear various figures bandied about for the cost of retrofitting the switch.. some say $0.57. some say $2.00. but what ever the switch cost to replace would only be part of the cost as the labor cost to replace or retrofit would amount to hundreds of millions of dollars would it not? Dealer shop rates would apply here would they not? The business case could not be made for the recall because the few millions that would likely be paid out for victims would in no way equal the total amount to recall each and every one of those cars. Their bean counters did the math and made their decision. Of course the engineering department was likely jumping up and down and saying "we have got to fix this" and maybe even the marketing department too, but in the end the bean counters got the ear of the top management and the decision was made. Now they have to live (or die) with it.

 

[Diamondpilot]

What does it matter now? Sound familiar. HS

Sounds like Ford Pinto all over again. You would think these manufacturers would learn.

Chris

 

[ruffdog]

One of the kids that died was drunk and speeding and hit a wooded area...also had a big keychain. I have been telling the wife for years that she don't need all them keys on the chain. Now, she finally "gets" it and separated the car keys.

 

[Gator6x4]

You know you hear various figures bandied about for the cost of retrofitting the switch.. some say $0.57. some say $2.00. but what ever the switch cost to replace would only be part of the cost as the labor cost to replace or retrofit would amount to hundreds of millions of dollars would it not? Dealer shop rates would apply here would they not? The business case could not be made for the recall because the few millions that would likely be paid out for victims would in no way equal the total amount to recall each and every one of those cars. Their bean counters did the math and made their decision. Of course the engineering department was likely jumping up and down and saying "we have got to fix this" and maybe even the marketing department too, but in the end the bean counters got the ear of the top management and the decision was made. Now they have to live (or die) with it.

Could have been a combination of "Marketing" and "Bean Counters". Marketing reported that people were complaining about the switch cylinder being difficult to rotate to the start position and was hurting there little hands. Bean Counter said, hey look we can save $.57 cents by changing this spring.

As an aside, have you seen some of the garbage that people, women especially have attached to ignition keys. Some that I have seen have to weigh more than an engineer who designed the switch anticipated.

I am old enough to have experience at owning several different makes and models of automobiles and trucks. I have had problems with some, more so than others. Even had one taken back under the "Buy Back" Lemon Law. The song and dance by all manufactures when dealing with defects is basically the same, IT IS A DEALER PROBLEM. Take the vehicle back to the Dealer, we only assemble them, he fixes them.