Do you like your R4 tires?

[buck12]

I have R4s and often wish for ags. Every time I get in the mud I want ags other wise I am happy with R4s. With the mud/clay in my area R4s load up quick and don't clean out well. Just today I was trying to get a bucket of clay for the base of a water bar and it was very frustrated with the R4s.

 

[milkman636]

I bought my first tractor with r4 tires last November. They are loaded with 90 gallons of rimguard. They still will leave a nice trail across grass. There really isn't any appreciable difference between my new r4 tracks and my older tractors r1 tracks in grass.

What I do notice is there have been several times that the rear end has broken track in the snow where I know my r1 won't. It seems like it still needs more weight on the tire even though I have over 900 lbs of ballast. I think the wider R4 rear tires really want to have ALOT of weight on them to perform.

Like you're thinking about now, I settled for R4s because I got a sweet deal on the tractor with them on it. I figured I'd try them out and see why they are so popular. Now that I have tried them, I probably won't buy them again. They work, but after decades with R1s I've come to expect and appreciate the traction they offer. Maybe the perfect combo would be loaded R1s on the rear with the wider R4s on the front. I wonder when we might see a manufacturer offer that combo?

 

[k0ua]

I love my R4's, but as pointed out earlier, we all don't have the same needs our uses or even the same type of soil.. get what is right for you. What might work well for me might be useless for you.

James K0UA

 

[RPW]

I've noticed one thing when people compare R1's and R4's in that they will reference construction equipment. Cool, but one thing is omitted is that construction equipment on average weighs alot more than what most people are buying for personal/ag use. So a R4 on a construction grade backhoe will operate quite differently than a smaller backhoe that we might purchase for our personal needs. That is going to translate into different traction gains/loses.

 

[ejkessler]

Maybe the perfect combo would be loaded R1s on the rear with the wider R4s on the front. I wonder when we might see a manufacturer offer that combo?

You can't mix and match, the actual base tire diameters minus the tread need to be matched accordingly. The tires and wheels are different sizes from any of the types to the other. They are very specifically designed for their matching front and rear. On a 2WD would not matter, with the 4WD your tranny and gears will be toast in no time.

 

[TripleR]

You can't mix and match, the actual base tire diameters minus the tread need to be matched accordingly. The tires and wheels are different sizes from any of the types to the other. They are very specifically designed for their matching front and rear. On a 2WD would not matter, with the 4WD your tranny and gears will be toast in no time.

We have been running this set up since 1986 and it was set up that way by the dealer. It is a geared unit, so maybe that makes a difference.

 

[milkman636]

The allowable 1-5% overspeed would allow for some variation in "actual base tire diameters minus the tread". With some careful tire selection I bet it wouldn't be a problem even on hard surfaces (where 4wd isn't needed). It probably just looks wrong so nobody wants to try it.

The advantage r4s offer is extra front tire width and load rating in small sizes. The r4 rears don't provide any real advantage that I can see.

 

[rebelback]

I wanted the R1's but my dealer didn't have any along with 6 other dealers I called. So, I settled for R4's since that is all I could get without ordering and paying a lot more. I got a 2010 Case Farmall 45 HST with FEL for $22,560. I thought that was a pretty awesome deal.

 

[beenthere]

Seems your dealer can order the next tractor of your size with Ag tires and switch them out for yours. Might have to delay taking ownership until that next tractor gets delivered so the dealer doesn't have to have used tires on a new tractor.

But I prefer the R-4's on my 4300 for most uses. Some woods work I know I'd have better traction, but the heavier ply sidewalls make for better woods work so it is a fair trade-off.
I also like how well the R-4's clean compared to my R-1's from previous days. That is a plus for me not having to drag so much mud around to other places. Now when in the wet clay, then it sticks to everything. Less disruption of the lawn with the R-4's.

 

[ejkessler]

We have been running this set up since 1986 and it was set up that way by the dealer. It is a geared unit, so maybe that makes a difference.

Good to know. I was basing my comment on a discussion I had with a dealer. I'd be willing to bet that those front tires base diameter are the same as the base of the normal turfs that would have gone with it. I guess I should not say always, just be careful if you do go that route.

 

[TripleR]

Good to know. I was basing my comment on a discussion I had with a dealer. I'd be willing to bet that those front tires base diameter are the same as the base of the normal turfs that would have gone with it. I guess I should not say always, just be careful if you do go that route.

I am sure they are as my father in law bought it new that way. We have replaced the tires once and they were ordered from a local dealer. I was kind of skeptical when he got it being from a farming background, but it works really well especially in the woods and on slopes.

If we ever have to replace them, I don't know if we will keep it that way or go with Ags. We don't use it much anymore, so my kids will probably be the ones to make that decision.

 

[Reg]

I'm wanting R1, agri, tires. However the dealer only has R4, industrial, tires on the tractor I want. He is going to try and find a set of agri tires to swap out with before I show up Saturday. In the event he can't I have to decide what to do. How do you like your R4 tires? Ever wish you had R1's?

Maybe too late to answer if you had to go in today...
Anyway, YES the R4s on the front are pretty much NEEDED if you use the FEL, and on the rear will take a lot more liquid ballast than R1s.
They also "float" in some muck that R1s "cut" into and rut - think ground pressure, etc.

 

[Reg]

You can't mix and match, the actual base tire diameters minus the tread need to be matched accordingly. The tires and wheels are different sizes from any of the types to the other. They are very specifically designed for their matching front and rear. On a 2WD would not matter, with the 4WD your tranny and gears will be toast in no time.

That depends on;
a) Whether the tractor has fragile gears/trans.
b) Whether you run it in 4WD on hard (good traction) surfaces.

I can't see a case for buying a tractor with fragile gears and trans, neither can I see a case for running in 4WD where traction is SO GOOD that it will take out even a fragile trans.

Up to 5% LEAD is good, just about ANY lag is BAD - the rear tends to go faster than the front, so steering a straight line becomes difficult.

 

[RobertN]

Need a "B" button on the steering wheel for better traction, like the Mach-5

Button B, Belt Tires (ベルトタイヤ, Beruto Taiya?, Belt Tire): Sprouts special grip tires for traction over any kind of terrain (firm, icy, or unsteady ground; ocean floor; vertical mountainsides).

YouTube - Mach 5: What Does This Button Do?

Mach 5: Button B - Belt Tires

 

[ejkessler]

That depends on;
a) Whether the tractor has fragile gears/trans.
b) Whether you run it in 4WD on hard (good traction) surfaces.

I can't see a case for buying a tractor with fragile gears and trans, neither can I see a case for running in 4WD where traction is SO GOOD that it will take out even a fragile trans.

Up to 5% LEAD is good, just about ANY lag is BAD - the rear tends to go faster than the front, so steering a straight line becomes difficult.

It is not about gears being fragile. There is no equipment that is designed for one axle to be working against the other. Simple physics. If you are on hard surface especially you see the result that much faster. There are some allowances for any setup for tire wear but even then the base diameter stays the same and that is where the tractor does its work.

 

[milkman636]

........................ I got a 2010 Case Farmall 45 HST with FEL for $22,560. I thought that was a pretty awesome deal.

Congratulations on the new tractor. 22500 is a good price for a new 45 hp HST tractor/loader combination in any color. I personally prefer red over blue. Enjoy!

 

[natman706]

Sometimes I think ag tires would be be good. I've heard they have the best traction compared to the industrial and turf tires. But they also do the most turf damage. I wonder if people sometimes change the front tires to ag and keep the rear tires industrial? When I get my new tractor in a few months i was thinking of doing that. To me it would make since have the ag tires on the front. ecspecially if your doing loader work.

 

[Reg]

It is not about gears being fragile. There is no equipment that is designed for one axle to be working against the other. Simple physics. If you are on hard surface especially you see the result that much faster. There are some allowances for any setup for tire wear but even then the base diameter stays the same and that is where the tractor does its work.

You can call it simple physics - I prefer to call it design parameters.
4WD tractors ARE designed for the front wheels (at the circumference) to turn a few percent faster than the rear.
This is a very desirable attribute.

Weights and loads are KNOWN, coefficients of friction between surface types are KNOWN.
It is POSSIBLE to design and manufacture for anticipated forces (& uses) in fact it is necessary to do so.
On hard surfaces the forces build up until the tire/road friction is overcome, typically quite suddenly - known colloquially as "wheel hop".
Tractors and other 4WD vehicles DO THIS and they DO SURVIVE - at least the adequately engineered ones do.
It is impractical for someone, for example moving snow, to shift out of 4WD every time they come out of a driveway and get back onto dry road to make a tight turn and go back in. Similar situations exist in the fields, though not so obvious and the changes in traction are not so extreme.

I have taken the occasional local "road trip" to neighbors' places and noticed at some point that the tractor is humming along in top gear and still in 4WD - no toast, no mechanical noises, no drama, no damage.
Again, adequately engineered tractor transmissions and axles CAN and DO take 4WD use on hard surfaces - though tire wear is likely accelerated.
I don't suggest or recommend this, but I don't live under a delusion that parts are going to suddenly fail "in no time".
I maintain that anything unable to take this is poorly engineered and/or manufactured - in a word "FRAGILE".

 

[Reg]

Sometimes I think ag tires would be be good. I've heard they have the best traction compared to the industrial and turf tires. But they also do the most turf damage. I wonder if people sometimes change the front tires to ag and keep the rear tires industrial? When I get my new tractor in a few months i was thinking of doing that. To me it would make since have the ag tires on the front. ecspecially if your doing loader work.

I think that would be exactly the wrong way around (-:
If you BELIEVE that R1s have better traction than R4s and that R4s have higher load rating;

R4s on the FRONT for loader use.
R1s on the REAR for traction.

Although you would be passing up the opportunity for 40+ % more liquid ballast in the rears.
I happen to "believe" (without incontrovertible experimental "proof") that the extra ballast and lower ground pressure result in a lower probability of rutting, i.e. loaded R4s CAUSE less damage of the sort that R1s MIGHT get you out of.

One configuration I saw a couple of years ago was "racing slicks" on the front of a tractor used for building/re-building baseball fields.
I talked to the guy and it seemed to make a lot of sense, he gets them for free when they are too worn to race on.
I forgot the size, 15 inch rims and very wide - he probably had turf tires on the back.

Just remember that baseball diamonds are pretty flat and although they spread and work on clay - your terrain may be very different and probably is (-:

In any case turf damage is more about tight turns on wet turf than tread pattern (-:

 

[ejkessler]

You can call it simple physics - I prefer to call it design parameters.
4WD tractors ARE designed for the front wheels (at the circumference) to turn a few percent faster than the rear.
This is a very desirable attribute.

Weights and loads are KNOWN, coefficients of friction between surface types are KNOWN.
It is POSSIBLE to design and manufacture for anticipated forces (& uses) in fact it is necessary to do so.
On hard surfaces the forces build up until the tire/road friction is overcome, typically quite suddenly - known colloquially as "wheel hop".
Tractors and other 4WD vehicles DO THIS and they DO SURVIVE - at least the adequately engineered ones do.
It is impractical for someone, for example moving snow, to shift out of 4WD every time they come out of a driveway and get back onto dry road to make a tight turn and go back in. Similar situations exist in the fields, though not so obvious and the changes in traction are not so extreme.

I have taken the occasional local "road trip" to neighbors' places and noticed at some point that the tractor is humming along in top gear and still in 4WD - no toast, no mechanical noises, no drama, no damage.
Again, adequately engineered tractor transmissions and axles CAN and DO take 4WD use on hard surfaces - though tire wear is likely accelerated.
I don't suggest or recommend this, but I don't live under a delusion that parts are going to suddenly fail "in no time".
I maintain that anything unable to take this is poorly engineered and/or manufactured - in a word "FRAGILE".

I never said that running a tractor on hard surface with 4WD was not to be done. What I said was that you need to make sure the corresponding tires on the front correspond to the rear. If you switch from on tread pattern on front different to the rear you need to make sure those sizes still correspond. That is plain and simple. Often times the sizes from one type of tread to another changes the tire diameter or original size. Example of R4's to R1's are often the case of difference in size/diameter. No machine is designed to handle that mixing and matching. I drive my 4wd tractors on hard surfaces in 4WD without issue and don't think second about it. The OP was talking about one type of tread on the front and a different type of tread on the rear. Once again, plain and simple, if those tire types are the same diameter of the base tire than you are okay. Why don't you put a tire and/or wheel of completely different size on your front or rear and leave the other in place and prove me wrong or have fun changing your tranny and/or gears.