jyoutz
Super Member
The real key is to build drainage into the road bed, either with ditches and wing ditches or crowns and rolling dips.
Packing/sealing a gravel road after 'resurfacing' / land plane
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jyoutz
Super Member
In the Forest Service one low cost technique we use is building rolling dips and wing ditches into the road profile during construction. But it takes a small dozer to do this. A road constructed with these features will hold up for many years with minimal maintenance.
Lavender Valley
Member
Here in New Zealand we us Basalt stone on roads and it ends up over the side or filling up the drains down the side of the road. We add a 20% lime chip in the load for problem roads, bad subgrade or steep, and spread that. I grade roads/driveways with my box blade and having tilt in my hydraulics I can crown the road, have to be quick as after a few passes the lime is doing its job of locking the stone into place.
mx842
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Gravel driveways are always going to need work as time goes by. You can pack all you want and there will always be a couple spots that will hold water and cause problems. My driveway is roughly 3/4's of a mile that drops in elevation 10' from the house to the main road. When I built the road the only place I could put in my driveway was through a swamp like area that was low and always held water. The first 1000' was a real bear and it took a lot of material to just get it to where I could back a truck in to dump using railroad stone. One spot it took 12 tandem loads of stone just to get 40'. I decided I had to come up with some other plan because this was getting expensive really quick. I bought a small dump truck and went to the local cinder block company where they had all the broken cinderblocks anyone would ever need. Once I started bringing these in things went a little quicker and I finally got up to where I was going to build my house, I covered the cinder blocks with bank gravel, and it was good enough to get in and out while they were working on my house. When a really heavy truck like a concrete truck came in, I would have to dress the road up a little before another came in.
This went on the whole time the work was going on and by the time the house was finished I could even get my wife's car up to the house without it bottoming out and not drag parts out from under it. Once all the heavy trucks were all gone, I covered it again with about 4" of bank gravel and left it that way for a couple years but every 6 months or so I would have to put more in certain spots to fill in potholes that would form in spots.
I knew this road was not going to be a once and done kind of deal and that I would have to work on it from time to time. Bank gravel is wonderful stuff but the problem with the material that was available was that it contained very little clay with mostly sand mixed with the gravel. The sand would allow water to seep into the base material and potholes would form quite often. I tried 21 A's that had a lot of rock dust mixed in and that helped but never sealed it off like it should.
Also, rainwater would wash out several places and I would have to add more every 6 months or so. I finally decided to flatten out the grade in several spots for 100' or so then let it fall again. This helped probably more than anything else I did with the whole road. That is until I found out about crushed concrete. Up to the time I started using this I would have to put down several loads a year to keep the road in shape. I covered the whole driveway with about 4" of crushed concrete and I have only had to add more about 2 times in the past 10 years. All I do is drag it once a year to knock the down the center to flatten it out again and I'm done, one trip down and one trip up and I'm done.
A gravel drive is always going to need some work in one place or another because every time you leave the drive you are going to take a part of your driveway along with you and it will need to be replaced.
This went on the whole time the work was going on and by the time the house was finished I could even get my wife's car up to the house without it bottoming out and not drag parts out from under it. Once all the heavy trucks were all gone, I covered it again with about 4" of bank gravel and left it that way for a couple years but every 6 months or so I would have to put more in certain spots to fill in potholes that would form in spots.
I knew this road was not going to be a once and done kind of deal and that I would have to work on it from time to time. Bank gravel is wonderful stuff but the problem with the material that was available was that it contained very little clay with mostly sand mixed with the gravel. The sand would allow water to seep into the base material and potholes would form quite often. I tried 21 A's that had a lot of rock dust mixed in and that helped but never sealed it off like it should.
Also, rainwater would wash out several places and I would have to add more every 6 months or so. I finally decided to flatten out the grade in several spots for 100' or so then let it fall again. This helped probably more than anything else I did with the whole road. That is until I found out about crushed concrete. Up to the time I started using this I would have to put down several loads a year to keep the road in shape. I covered the whole driveway with about 4" of crushed concrete and I have only had to add more about 2 times in the past 10 years. All I do is drag it once a year to knock the down the center to flatten it out again and I'm done, one trip down and one trip up and I'm done.
A gravel drive is always going to need some work in one place or another because every time you leave the drive you are going to take a part of your driveway along with you and it will need to be replaced.
aircommuter
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This is where the proper fabric used correctly could have helped. Second choice would be post tension slab. $$. Dragging the center segregates the material and removes the crown.
mx842
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I agree with the fabric part, but you still need to get down to some solid ground and in this case at least 3' of material would have had to be removed to get there. This would have required an excavator which I didn't have. All I had at the time was a Cat 955 K. It did have wide tracks but as it would walk over the soft spots it was worthless when trying to move any of the soggy material. I had no choice but to try and bridge over it and hope for the best. As with most of my projects I have to use what I have. That first 40' was the most expensive. That railroad ballast was worthless, but I already ordered it and 10 of the loads were already on the road and they wouldn't call them back. Once I switched over to the crushed cinder blocks it was a piece of cake. I know, not perfect but it was all I could do at the time, and it all worked out in the end. That was 32 years ago, and I could land a 747 on it today. 
aircommuter
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Fabric can reduce the amount of bridging material. We found that when 4-5’ thickness of bridging was needed we could get stabilization with 2’. Proper fabric and proper material. We always had to obtain 95% relative Proctor and soils engineer approval.
JRH02
Silver Member
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Here, all the parcels (mostly 40 ac or greater, off grid) are privately owned and access is via an ancient logging trail with easements and a few branches/intersections through various parcels. We are the only full time residents which means everyone else shows up a few times a year and many never at all. The age old cooperative agreement is that all land owners maintain the road on/through their parcel. You can imagine how that works out in reality especially on BIA set aside and State owned parcels - it doesn't happen. By nature the road is rough, steep and curvy with a few switchbacks in moderate to heavily treed land. No one is going to spend any money let alone remove a downed tree or even get out to throw off a few stones.
The point I'm making is that the better the road the faster the vehicles drive. In addition, the better the road the more chance that city people will try to travel the trail with their 2WD cars/whatever leaving a trail of plastic and stones kicked out of the road base from spinning. This also happens with jerks driving the trail who refuse to lock hubs and use 4wd which should actually be done year round when climbing. I don't even need to bring up ATVs and dirt bikes do I?
My solution? LATERALS for drainage. They are really important and functional for road longevity and are my version of a reverse speed bump for rural use and control of A$$****s. And I never put one at right angles to the road. I put them at least enough angle so that on a given axle, one side is out as the other enters. This works really good to keep things at about 10mph max or they'll lose it and hit a tree or end up somewhere down the canyon.
Yup, it takes about 20 minutes to get 2.5 miles to the nearest maintained county road. It's actually a very pretty drive.
The point I'm making is that the better the road the faster the vehicles drive. In addition, the better the road the more chance that city people will try to travel the trail with their 2WD cars/whatever leaving a trail of plastic and stones kicked out of the road base from spinning. This also happens with jerks driving the trail who refuse to lock hubs and use 4wd which should actually be done year round when climbing. I don't even need to bring up ATVs and dirt bikes do I?
My solution? LATERALS for drainage. They are really important and functional for road longevity and are my version of a reverse speed bump for rural use and control of A$$****s. And I never put one at right angles to the road. I put them at least enough angle so that on a given axle, one side is out as the other enters. This works really good to keep things at about 10mph max or they'll lose it and hit a tree or end up somewhere down the canyon.
Yup, it takes about 20 minutes to get 2.5 miles to the nearest maintained county road. It's actually a very pretty drive.
paulsharvey
Elite Member
So, there is a Right way to build a road, and the cold hard reality of money, and what works to make a functional, 4 season driveway. For a truly one and done approach, I would spec, 12" of stabalized subgrade LBR40, density 98%, 6" of limerock road base, 98%; remove any organic or elastic clay 24" Below subgrade, and back fill with clean A2 sand, 98%. All of that, and that's just the road bed, beyond that, I would spec 4 ft of grossed shoulder, sloping away from roadway at 6%, then a 4:1 ditch, with an invert approx at the bottom of the subgrade; 15" min cross drains, ect.
Then we have home owner reality, and budget. I would strip any highly organic or pumping clay, compact, add 6" of roadbase, crown; have approx 4 ft of shoulder sloping away from the drive, and a ditch with an invert below the. bottom of the base. I still would use 15" pipe for drainage crossings, not 4 or 6".
It's the 80/20 rule. The 2nd example, you very well might get settling in some areas, or minor rutting; and you will add material as needed. If you have really bad ground water, and or fat clays, maybe a geotextile and some rip rap, or just figure on adding additional base every 3 years.
The "Right" approach, just isn't realistic for most rural properties
Then we have home owner reality, and budget. I would strip any highly organic or pumping clay, compact, add 6" of roadbase, crown; have approx 4 ft of shoulder sloping away from the drive, and a ditch with an invert below the. bottom of the base. I still would use 15" pipe for drainage crossings, not 4 or 6".
It's the 80/20 rule. The 2nd example, you very well might get settling in some areas, or minor rutting; and you will add material as needed. If you have really bad ground water, and or fat clays, maybe a geotextile and some rip rap, or just figure on adding additional base every 3 years.
The "Right" approach, just isn't realistic for most rural properties
paulsharvey
Elite Member
You Do Want the roadbed/driving surface wider than vehicle, so, at 12 ft driving surface would be a real min, and for many reasons, you want a min clear opening of 16 ft, from any obstacles or drop offs. That allows passing, larger vehicles, deliveries, and now, many emergency services state they won't go down a drive with less than 16 ft clear width.
A 12 ft drive, with 8 ft total shoulder, vehicles can come to a stop and a slow pass.
A 12 ft drive, with 8 ft total shoulder, vehicles can come to a stop and a slow pass.
