foton 404 tractor fluids a d where to put them :)

[Wa11banger]

Hello everyone my name is Rick and not only am I new to TBN but I am also new to tractors and basically any heavy equipment.

I bought a 2004 Foton 404 with a Koyker loader on it less than 24 hours ago and have been having some good fun in the backyard.

I searched and read many posts here on the forum and have some questions. Unfortunately some will be repeats because I dont think I quite understand the information in the post previously. Also I am quite mechanically minded just mostly on cars, trucks, etc I have no experience on big equipment nor hydraulics but I am pretty sure with minor education from you all they wont be that much more difficult just bigger and heavier.

Like with all used things bought, I want to change out all the fluids.

1) fluids? Ok I read several posts on this I am going to quote what I think was the best answer to it but still would like some clarity.

For the engine, I use Shell Rotella T 15W40. If Canada uses the API Rating system like we do, any 15W40 will do - as long as it's rated API-CF or betterFor the front diff/tranny/rear diff I use Shell Spirax HD 80W90. If Shell is hard to come by, select an 80W90 that is both anti-foaming AND safe for yellow metals. If that one confuses you, it's mentioned enough times in this forum where the search engine will bring back clarification.It can get cold here in the winter, so I use AW32 (ISO32) hydraulic fluid year round. Brand is not important to me, as long as it's clearly marked as non-foamingMost folks will use engine oil in the injection pump, but I prefer full detergent ISO100 compressor oil.*And of course, a minimum 50/50 mixture of a decent green antifreeze/water for the cooling system. If you're a winter user, maybe 60/40, but never more than 70/30//greg//

Engine part is easy. Identification of where and somewhat which fluid goes exactly where is the part I am having the most problem with the above quote. Mostly because the manual calls out a tractor transmission/ hydraulic fluid for the geartrain, transmission, and steering. Now I have found a dipstick under a rubber round panel plug in the center floor panel. Its quite long and has plenty of fluid although somewhat murky. It does not smell like gear oil. Is this the transmission? What American fluid here? Is the tranny and rear gear the same? I cannot find what I think is a gearbox fill/check plug.

I also have a vent/dipstick/fill plug on the top left of the lift arm gear box this fluid is fairly clean and I assume is different because of location and it has its own dipstick. I was assuming hydraulic fluid here but it roughly has the same viscosity as the one mentioned above.

Power steering pump left side of engine needs fluid but the above quote confuses me as to what to use there.

Also have a small reservoir on the right top side of the engine, seems to head into/out of a set of twin hyd pumps just below it which goes all the way back to the side of the lift gearbox and the front end loader. Very clean fluid here, clearish and I have no idea what its for lol.

I think I will stop thequestions there for now so I dont overload the post and end up having it go several different directions

Thanks all in advance for your assistance.

 

[zonta223]

Hi
You need the following fluids for the gearbox/rear diff, hydraulics. power steering. Note the gearbox does not use 80w90 gear oil.
The oil is Massey Ferguson mf1135 or ford m2c 86a or JD J20a . I think this is the equivalent of what we call Universal Tractor Oil 10/30w .

You can also use this in the front diff or the 80w90.

The gearbox filler is on the transmission tunnel hidden under an oval rubber plug.

Don't forget to change the oil in the injection pump I use the same oil as the engine.

Enjoy your Foton I love mine

 

[Wa11banger]

Hi
You need the following fluids for the gearbox/rear diff, hydraulics. power steering. Note the gearbox does not use 80w90 gear oil.
The oil is Massey Ferguson mf1135 or ford m2c 86a or JD J20a . I think this is the equivalent of what we call Universal Tractor Oil 10/30w .

You can also use this in the front diff or the 80w90.

The gearbox filler is on the transmission tunnel hidden under an oval rubber plug.

Don't forget to change the oil in the injection pump I use the same oil as the engine.

Enjoy your Foton I love mine

Thanks for your response I appreciate it.

I think I have screwed up already. The power steering was not working well while sitting still so I was looking around and found a cap that I originally thought was a power steering pump (left front side of engine) so I started pouring universal fluid in there and noticed it said oil on top I have not started it yet but have not figured out how to drain it or what it is yet. I guess I need to leave my car mechanic personality at home when working on the tractor. I looked through the manual and it doesnt tell me what that area is or how to drain it.

 

[Wa11banger]

By the way I did find the gearbox fill plug but didnt find a rearend fill plug. Are they one and the same?

 

[Wa11banger]

Finally some success. I found the manual for a nortrac 40xt online and the english is much better and so are the instructions.. I was able to drain the engine oil without having to start it to reposition it so I have little concern there I just need to not do that again lol

 

[greg_g]

Hang on, isn't the FT404 a twin-sump tractor? You only use UTF for common sump tractors. I'm pretty sure the original fluids recommendation you cited in the opening post is correct for your tractor. Wa11banger, check your manual for recommended fluids. If it specs both gear oil and hydraulic fluid, don't waste your money on UTF. It will be too thin for the gears, and too thick for the hydraulics. Regarding anti-freeze, I'm not sure if the FT404 engine is wet-sleeved or dry-sleeved. Conventional automotive coolant is appropriate for dry sleeves, but causes cavitation behind wet sleeves. I recommend erring on the safe side and using an anti-freeze that is stated to have an SCA (anti-cavitation) additive. I use Peak Fleet Charge 50/50

Oh, and I'd advise against relying on a Nortrac manual to work on a Foton. That would not be much different than using a Ford manual to work on a Chevy. The correct manuals for the FT404 comes in a set of three, and costs about $85. I strongly recommend the purchase.

//greg//

 

[Wa11banger]

Greg,
Thanks for chiming in here the original quote was yours from a previous post I found while trying to clarify what to put where. I apologize but I am the extreme noob to tractors and that was part of the reason for the questions in this post was where to put the fluids identified.

Engine easy (well at least now that I know you can add oil up top in the valve cover and bottom on the left.. and as I discovered the bottom left is not the power steering pump lol) I changed the oil already with shell Rotella T without starting it so no real UTF left in the oil pan and I don't think sitting in there overnight caused any issue.

As for twin sump or not I cannot determine. Mostly because I have no idea how to tell the difference. I have identified only three places to add fluid other than the engine
1) rear left corner above lift arms has a breather vent cap with a dip stick on it
2) center of floor panel between feet large bolt head with really long dipstick on it looks to go into the drive-train but pretty hard to see down there
3) Smaller tank right hand top side of engine for power steering
I have looked everywhere for more plugs and drains and have been unsuccessful at finding any. The very few tractor owners I know just scratch there head and say well I dont know so far havent been able to convince one to come over and give me even a best guess tour of the tractor even with beer bribes

I have three manuals for the tractor but they are very poor in describing what things are and where to put fluids, etc. I have a owners manual, the engine manual and a parts catalog. Are these the three in the pack that you are describing?

Thanks again guys for chiming in I do appreciate it.

Rick

 

[zonta223]

Hang on, isn't the FT404 a twin-sump tractor? You only use UTF for common sump tractors. I'm pretty sure the original fluids recommendation you cited in the opening post is correct for your tractor. Wa11banger, check your manual for recommended fluids. If it specs both gear oil and hydraulic fluid, don't waste your money on UTF. It will be too thin for the gears, and too thick for the hydraulics. Regarding anti-freeze, I'm not sure if the FT404 engine is wet-sleeved or dry-sleeved. Conventional automotive coolant is appropriate for dry sleeves, but causes cavitation behind wet sleeves. I recommend erring on the safe side and using an anti-freeze that is stated to have an SCA (anti-cavitation) additive. I use Peak Fleet Charge 50/50

Oh, and I'd advise against relying on a Nortrac manual to work on a Foton. That would not be much different than using a Ford manual to work on a Chevy. The correct manuals for the FT404 comes in a set of three, and costs about $85. I strongly recommend the purchase.

//greg//

Hi Greg.
I was quoting from the manual when I said UTF. That is the recommended transmission oil. Also used in the hydraulics and power steering. And yes the tractor is a twin sump model.

 

[Rich Waugh]

Rick:

Look on the front axle assemblies for fill plugs. Many Chinese manufacturers paint them red, but yours may differ. Might be one, might be two.

 

[Wa11banger]

Thanks guys for the info.. Greg or Zonta what is meant by twin sump? the fact that the hydraulic lift and the gearbox are separate fluid capacity areas or is that to mean that the rear diff and transmission are separate fluid capacity areas?

Thanks Rich I found two plugs on each side of the axle tubes straight up on top (12 o clock) position roughly even in the middle of the length of the tubes. They seem pretty small, are these fill areas? I will check around the gearbox area again when I get home from work.. The tubing from the FEL may have blocked my view and i will get all the way under there tonight.

Again guys thanks for your help