Am I legal? Tow weight question (weights listed)

[Duffster]

I believe he used the wrong term- The receiver, not the coupler, on the tow vehicle (TV) is only rated for 1000 or 1250 pounds max and that is with WD, without the WD the max would be half.

We can't assume that, since hitches capable of 2000# are readily available.

There is no way for the 1950 lb delta between the GVW and axle rating to be legally or safely transferred to the TV.

Sure there is.

 

[VitaBene]

We can't assume that, since hitches capable of 2000# are readily available.



Sure there is.

Based on the fact that he did not note either owning a Reese Titan or Curt 18000 lb hitch; and did not mention WD I think we can assume he did not upgrade.

Regardless, you know as well as I that a 9000 lb trailer should not need to have 22% of tongue weight to make listed GVW. It would be poor loading technique at best and would tax a 3/4 ton P/U.

 

[RobertN]

So after all the back and forth, I still am shaking my head.

What I would like to know, is where do you find the facts for all this instead of a bunch of speculation? No on has fessed up any data or source of facts. Where would one look?

My 5th wheel is rated 7500lbs, but sits on two 7000lbs axles. I assume they factor in part of that weight rating based on the kingpin load? Do they rate 5th wheels differently, or is this another case like the OP?

I would like to know how or why you think the GVWR has to be the sum total of the axle ratings.

 

[Duffster]

Based on the fact that he did not note either owning a Reese Titan or Curt 18000 lb hitch; and did not mention WD I think we can assume he did not upgrade.

Regardless, you know as well as I that a 9000 lb trailer should not need to have 22% of tongue weight to make listed GVW. It would be poor loading technique at best and would tax a 3/4 ton P/U.

Never assume.

 

[VitaBene]

So after all the back and forth, I still am shaking my head.

What I would like to know, is where do you find the facts for all this instead of a bunch of speculation? No on has fessed up any data or source of facts. Where would one look?

My 5th wheel is rated 7500lbs, but sits on two 7000lbs axles. I assume they factor in part of that weight rating based on the kingpin load? Do they rate 5th wheels differently, or is this another case like the OP?

Hi,

It is really not speculation in your case. You are likely fine (vehicle dependent)- acceptable hitch weight for most RV type 5th wheel trailers is approx. 20-25%. You can easily transfer 1500 0f your 7500lb onto your truck.

For 5th wheel info try rv.net. Also Reese or whoever made your hitch should have info on their site.

 

[Duffster]

So after all the back and forth, I still am shaking my head.

What I would like to know, is where do you find the facts for all this instead of a bunch of speculation? No on has fessed up any data or source of facts. Where would one look?

My 5th wheel is rated 7500lbs, but sits on two 7000lbs axles. I assume they factor in part of that weight rating based on the kingpin load? Do they rate 5th wheels differently, or is this another case like the OP?

Our gooseneck's GVWR is higher than the axle ratings as well. There are absolutely NO set rules for this stuff. A trailer manufactuer can rate a trailer for whatever it feels like, be it more or less than the axles ratings.

 

[Diamondpilot]

So after all the back and forth, I still am shaking my head.

What I would like to know, is where do you find the facts for all this instead of a bunch of speculation? No on has fessed up any data or source of facts. Where would one look?

My 5th wheel is rated 7500lbs, but sits on two 7000lbs axles. I assume they factor in part of that weight rating based on the kingpin load? Do they rate 5th wheels differently, or is this another case like the OP?

Looks like your math is off a little there but the answer to your question is yes. Most GN and 5th wheel equipment I have been around they allow 15 to 20% on the pin.

This is legal to do on a bumper pull but is not a common practice on certifying them. The ones I have seen allow for 10% max so on a trailer equipped with 2 3,500# axles it will be rated for 7,700# GVWR.

Chris

 

[VitaBene]

Never assume.

I'm done going back and forth on this one. I know what a properly loaded trailer is (and have a feeling you do too). I have owned aand operated 3 Hudson Bros trailers (2 HSE-16s and a 12T tilt deck) and found them to be good trailers so I am not knocking them as a company. In this case they pushed it.

 

[JIGBUILDER]

someone ask for a 205/ -15" D rated tire. Their out there. See maxxis tire web http://http://www.maxxis.com/AutomobileLight-Truck/Light-Truck-SUV/UE-168N-Bravo-Series.aspx for UE-168 LT tires.

The trailer is weighed per axle and tire capacities per NHTSA/DOT571.110/.120
S4.2.2.1 Except as provided in
S4.2.2.2, the sum of the maximum load
ratings of the tires fitted to an axle
shall not be less than the GAWR of the
axle system as specified on the vehicleç—´
certification label required by 49
CFR part 567. If the certification label
shows more than one GAWR for the
axle system, the sum shall be not less
than the GAWR corresponding to the
size designation of the tires fitted to
the axle.( end of quote)

Dot weighs the axle loads on the trailer and then looks at the tires for matching numbers. If there is a difference then a DOT officer may go under the trailer to see what the axle are tagged at. Tires capacities and axle ratings had better = GVWR. Some state DOTs go to the tires capacities. Some go with axles and tires.

The only place the truck or trailers GVWR is used is for a combined rating. The only place a combined rating is used is on the commercial side for over 26001 combined towing.

The 4x4 tractor/loader/mower in the OP thread will probably be to heavy for a trailer with two 3500 axles. The tractor probably weighs over 4000 lbs plus another 500-600 for the mower and another 1500 for the loader plus fluid filled tires.

 

[RobertN]

Yes, I meant two 3500lbs axles...

It is a Fleetwood Wilderness 27', no slides, kinda basic. It has two Dexter 3500lbs axles. The tag on the rig says it is 6500lb dry, 7500lb max loaded weight. Used the tag and original axle booklet to get new brake shoes; they are marked 3500lbs.

So the extra 500lbs is considered part of that 15-20% allowed on 5th wheels?

Looks like your math is off a little there but the answer to your question is yes. Most GN and 5th wheel equipment I have been around they allow 15 to 20% on the pin.

This is legal to do on a bumper pull but is not a common practice on certifying them. The ones I have seen allow for 10% max so on a trailer equipped with 2 3,500# axles it will be rated for 7,700# GVWR.

Chris